133. When the Church Looks Away: Chronic Illness, Faith, and the Call to Love with Claire Staples and Sarah Perry

What happens when the body of Christ forgets its own?

In this powerful episode of The Bad Roman Podcast, Claire Staples (The Clarity Podcast) and Sarah Perry (Voluntarism in Action) join host Craig Harguess for a conversation that exposes the gap between what churches preach—and how they treat the chronically ill. Drawing from their lived experiences within the LDS Church and broader Christian communities, they explore what it means to suffer in faith while being ignored by the very institutions meant to offer support.

Both women share how chronic illness is often not only misunderstood but actively stigmatized within religious settings. Instead of being met with compassion, those with long-term illnesses are often sidelined, silenced, or blamed for their own suffering. Their stories are a sobering look at how churches—particularly those entangled with state-aligned ideologies and cultural expectations—can lose sight of Christ’s command to care for "the least of these."

The Hidden Burden: When Suffering Meets Silence

Claire and Sarah’s experiences reveal a troubling pattern: while churches may rally around someone facing a temporary injury or illness, chronic conditions are another story.

• Church leaders suggested their illnesses were spiritual failures—evidence of insufficient faith or unrepented sin.

• Expectations to “perform” remained unchanged, even when health was failing.

• Requests for help were met with cold bureaucracy or outright neglect.

As Sarah put it: “People hear the word ‘disease’ and they lose it.” The fear of illness—and the discomfort it brings—often leads communities to withdraw rather than draw near.

These moments beg a difficult but necessary question: Are we building churches that reflect Christ, or churches that maintain appearances?

A Return to the Gospel’s Core

Rather than offering cynicism, this episode calls for renewal. Claire and Sarah ground their critiques not in bitterness, but in Scripture. They point to the life of Jesus and the stories that define what it truly means to follow Him:

• The Good Samaritan reminds us that love is inconvenient—and that holiness is shown in how we treat those others ignore.

• Jesus’ healing of lepers challenges the impulse to keep our hands clean when our neighbors are in pain.

• The story of Job warns against the human tendency to explain away suffering with judgment.

These biblical examples offer more than comfort—they offer a roadmap back to the kind of faith that moves toward people, not systems. As Claire noted, “We need to bring it back to basics, back to home and family. Then we would all know Jesus better.”

What the Church Can Do Better

The conversation also offers tangible steps for churches and individuals who want to support chronically ill members with more integrity and compassion:

• Educate congregations on the realities of chronic illness.

• Offer support that doesn’t hinge on a person’s ability to serve or attend.

• Resist the temptation to “fix” suffering with theology—start by listening.

• Build inclusive spaces that reflect the full diversity of the body of Christ.

Claire and Sarah challenge the tendency to outsource care—whether to medical institutions or church programs—and remind us that the call of Christ is personal. The Gospel is not a system; it is a way of being with one another.

Faith in the Midst of Pain

Perhaps the most transformative thread in this episode is the reimagining of suffering itself—not as a sign of divine punishment, but as a crucible that can deepen intimacy with Christ. Both guests reject the prosperity gospel’s promise of health as a sign of favor, and instead point to the promise of God’s presence through the valley.

Suffering doesn’t disqualify us from God's love—it draws us deeper into it.

As Claire shared, “I don’t think I would have fully understood what Jesus did for me on the cross if I hadn’t suffered horrendously at no fault of my own.”

This conversation is a challenge—and an invitation. A call to rethink what it means to be the Church. A reminder that faith is not proven by perfection, but by how we love one another through imperfection, weakness, and pain.

Connect With Our Guests:

Claire Staples – The Clarity Podcast

Claire shares faith-centered conversations on recovering from high-demand religion, chronic illness, and returning to Christ-centered living.

• Podcast: The Clarity Podcast on Spotify

• Instagram: @theclarity.podcast

• YouTube Channel: The Clarity Podcast on YouTube

• Website + Nonprofit: ChronicallyBeautifulLife.com

  • Learn more about the Chronically Care Project and donate or contribute to care packages for the chronically ill.

Sarah Perry – Voluntarism in Action

Sarah volunteers with VIA, a liberty-rooted nonprofit providing direct aid and resources to communities in need—without state involvement.

• Organization Website: viaction.org

• Instagram: @voluntarism_in_action

  • Support ongoing humanitarian campaigns (e.g. Gaza relief, Congo gardens, US seed kits)

  • Sign up to receive free spring gardening kits (US-only) to promote food sovereignty

• Blog: VIA’s website also features resources on mutual aid, self-sufficiency, and disaster relief.

Episode Timestamps:

(0:02) Introduction to the Bad Roman Podcast

• Guests Claire Staples and Sarah Perry join to discuss chronic illness and the church

• Previous Episode with Claire: From Mormon LDS to Freedom in Christ: Unveiling Lies in Medicine, Government, and Religion

• Previous Episode with Sarah: Christian Ethics and Stateless Societies: The Anarchist Approach of the Perry Family

(0:22) Exploring Christian Responsibility in Healthcare

• Discussion on whether Christians are doing enough for the sick

• Questioning the comfort with government management of healthcare for Christians

(0:45) Claire and Sarah's Background with Chronic Illness

• Both guests share experiences with chronic illness in the LDS (Mormon) Church

• Instances of being shunned or misunderstood due to their health conditions

(2:11) Claire's Nonprofit Work

• Introduction to the Chronically Care Project, supporting those with chronic illnesses

• Insights gained from working with chronically ill individuals globally

(4:30) Sarah's Experience with Chronic Illness and Church

• Growing up with vague symptoms in an abusive family

• Expectations and disappointments within the Mormon Church community

(7:41) Church Leadership Response to Illness

• Sarah's experience of being shunned by church leaders for being sick

• Discussion on the importance of temple recommends in Mormon culture

(12:07) Comparing Church Experiences to Cult Documentaries

• Craig draws parallels between the guests' experiences and cult-like behaviors

• Reflection on the control and hierarchy within religious organizations

(17:21) Cultural Influences on Church Attitudes Towards Illness

• How state and government attitudes infiltrate church culture regarding chronic illness

• Examples of church leaders' responses to requests for help and understanding

(25:48) The Role of Medical System in Church Attitudes

• Discussion on the church's reliance on mainstream medical systems

• Critique of outsourcing care to doctors instead of providing community support

(30:28) LDS Church's Relationship with Government and Healthcare

• Exploration of the church's investments in medical and pharmaceutical industries

• Comparison of church tithing to government taxation

(36:06) Scriptural Solutions for Caring for the Sick

• Analysis of the Good Samaritan parable and its relevance to chronic illness care

• Discussion on Jesus' treatment of lepers and its modern application

(49:33) The Book of Job and Suffering

• Interpretation of Job's story in relation to chronic illness and faith

• Exploration of spiritual warfare and demonic influences on attitudes towards suffering

(1:03:38) Why Bad Things Happen to Good People

• Discussion on God's role in suffering and the nature of a fallen world

• Personal story from Craig about his niece's cancer diagnosis

(1:12:26) God's Love and Community Support

• Reflection on God's nature as love and the importance of community in times of suffering

• Craig shares positive experiences of support for his niece

(1:15:11) Closing Thoughts and Resource Sharing

• Claire and Sarah share information about their projects and podcasts

• Encouragement for listeners to engage with resources for supporting the chronically ill

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100. Christian Ethics and Stateless Societies: The Anarchist Approach of the Perry Family

In the 100th episode of the podcast, host Craig Harguess is joined by guests Sarah and Jeff Perry from Voluntaryism in Action for a captivating exploration into the confluence of Christian values and the philosophy of anarchy. This milestone episode delves into the nuances of Christian Anarchism and Voluntarism, examining the personal metamorphoses that steer individuals away from traditional political paradigms toward a life of voluntary statelessness underpinned by faith. 

Throughout the episode, Sarah and Jeff Perry share the hurdles encountered in seeking a like-minded community and the challenges a society deeply ingrained with state-oriented ideologies poses. They shed light on the essence of fellowship and kinship, even in the digital sphere, for those who perceive themselves as misfits in a world unprepared for such radical ideas. The conversation also touches on the difficulty of communicating complex ideas over social media and the importance of giving people grace and meeting them where they are, as they were once in a similar position. The group emphasizes that the people they may joke about now were once reflections of their past selves, highlighting the transformative journey that led them to their current ideological stance. 

Taking an unexpected detour, the discussion ventures into the rustic world of homesteading, contrasting the merits of duck and chicken eggs and unpacking the symbolism it holds for Christian anarchists. This segment uncovers the layers of self-reliance and philosophical maturation, accompanied by a narrative of Jeff’s military service and how he underwent a profound ideological shift towards anarchism. 

The episode critically addresses the contentious interpretation of Romans 13 from an anarchist perspective, scrutinizing the alignment—or lack thereof—between modern democratic establishments and the teachings of Jesus. The discourse celebrates the significance of genuine leadership as demonstrated by Jesus, compared to the forceful rule often exhibited by earthly authorities. 

The discussion also spotlights the impactful initiatives of Voluntaryism in Action, emphasizing the human connections nurtured through voluntary charity. This starkly contrasts the impersonal touch of institutionalized aid, underscoring the human and spiritual dimensions of giving.

 Listeners are treated to a blend of humor, social commentary, and personal anecdotes that exemplify the intertwining of Christianity's core tenets with the principles of voluntaryism. As the 100th episode of the podcast, this thought-provoking journey offers an inspiring vision of community, support, and voluntary action shaped by love, grace, understanding, and Christian values.

Connect with the Perrys:

Website

Podcast: Voluntary View on Spotify, iTunes, Youtube

Key Moments:

00:02 Exploring Christian Anarchism and Voluntaryism

• Introduction to the intersection of Christianity and statelessness.

• Personal journeys from conventional politics to stateless existence based on Christian values.

• Importance of community, even if primarily online.

01:11 The Reach of the Bad Roman

• Discussion on the international reach of the podcast.

• Personal reflections on discovering Christian Anarchy.

• Surprise at finding a community with similar beliefs.

09:08 Duck Eggs and Freshly Laid Eggs

• Discussion on homesteading, duck vs. chicken eggs.

• Nutritional content and taste comparison.

• Personal anecdotes about self-sufficiency and philosophical evolution.

15:22 - Military Transition to Anarchism & Non-Judgmental Dialogue

• A former military medical officer's ideological shift towards anarchism.

• Impact of literature and libertarian thought on worldview.

• Emphasis on non-judgmental engagement within the anarchist community.

23:13 Christian Anarchism and the Bad Project

• Craig's journey from neoconservatism to Christian anarchism.

• Misconceptions about Christian Anarchy clarified.

• Sharing personal revelations about faith and statelessness.

26:41 Facebook Thread Drama and Miscommunication

• Addressing miscommunication and drama in a Facebook thread.

• Emphasis on understanding different perspectives within anarchism.

30:05 Understanding Anarchy and Romans 13 (11 Minutes)

• Interpretation of Romans 13 in the context of Christian anarchy.

• Biblical examples of resistance to secular authorities.

• Addressing objections related to submission to governing authorities.

33:57 Not Voting and Complaining About Government

• Discussion on Craig's decision not to vote and its implications.

• The counterintuitive nature of the argument that non-voters cannot complain.

38:41 Voluntarism and Anarchy

• Explanation of voluntarism as a subset of anarchy.

• Voluntarism focuses on voluntary interactions without coercion.

41:22 Religion, Government, and Accountability

• Differences between authority figures and authoritarianism.

• Critique of representative democracy and accountability.

• Reflection on the role of law enforcement and early church teachings.

49:57 Christian Anarchism and Voluntaryism Action

• Exploration of how Voluntaryism in Action embodies Christian Anarchist principles.

• Discussion on the organization's initiatives and community impact.

• Tension between Christianity and statism in church settings.

• Discomfort with nationalistic practices in worship.

• Early Christian teachings versus modern interpretations post-Constantine.

55:42 Voluntaryism

• Origins and evolution of a charitable organization, Voluntaryism in Action.

• Challenges and misconceptions surrounding non-profit work.

• Importance of voluntary giving and the impact of government programs on charity.

57:07 Obtaining & Maintaining 501(c)3 Status

• The process and challenges of obtaining 501(c)3 status for the organization.

• Insights into maintaining non-profit status and its importance.

01:04:18 Voluntaryism in Action

• Celebration of the work and achievements of Voluntaryism in Action.

• Personal anecdotes that underscore the organization's ethos.

01:09:36 Discussion on Voluntaryism in Action

• Impactful work of Voluntaryism in Action aligned with Christian values.

• Encouragement for listener support through donations or involvement.

• Challenges of social media censorship.

01:11:39 Twitter Campaigns and Content Restrictions

• Addressing the impact of content restrictions on social media campaigns.

• The organization's approach to creating and sharing provocative content.

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