157. Freemasonry vs. Christianity: Hidden Altars of Government with Scipio Eruditus

What happens when we start asking where our public myths came from? Not just our slogans, but our symbols. Not just our laws, but the spiritual imagination sitting underneath them.

In this episode of The Bad Roman Podcast, Craig sits down with Scipio Eruditus of Dispatches from Reality to talk about the historical and theological entanglements between Freemasonry, Christianity, and the state. On the surface, that might sound like a niche topic. But the deeper the conversation goes, the more it starts to feel like a mirror. Why are Christians so quick to trust power? Why do symbols on currency, patriotic myths, and secret oaths seem easier for many people to defend than the plain teachings of Jesus?

This is not a light conversation, but it is an important one. Scipio shares how his own journey, from military service and patriotism to deep suspicion of government, forced him to rethink the stories he once believed. And as the episode unfolds, the bigger question comes into view: can followers of Jesus stay awake in a world built on hidden loyalties, or will we keep baptizing government and calling it righteousness?

From patriotism to disillusionment

Scipio’s story begins with the kind of loyalty many Americans understand. He joined the Air Force in the wake of 9/11 believing he was fighting for freedom. But war has a way of exposing the distance between what we are told and what is true. What happens when the script falls apart in real time? What do we do when the nation we trusted starts to look less like a protector and more like a storyteller protecting its own image?

That experience became a crack in the wall. The guest describes Afghanistan as a turning point, not only because of the violence, but because of the lies that seemed to surround it. Later, his involvement in a fraternity opened another door, this time into rituals, symbols, and hidden inheritances that would lead him into researching Freemasonry in much greater depth. Sometimes awakening does not come all at once. Sometimes it comes in layers, one false promise at a time.

“It was an absolutely major paradigm shift for me... and has forced me to look at the constitution and the founding of this nation in a much more critical light.” (10:03)

The mystery beneath the surface

Craig wisely begins with the language of mystery, pulling from 2 Thessalonians and asking whether the foundations of the United States are more spiritually loaded than most Christians realize. That is where the episode gets especially provocative. Scipio argues that Freemasonry is not just a fraternal club or harmless social network, but a modern expression of a much older spiritual rebellion, one that promises enlightenment, self-perfection, and power apart from God.

Whether listeners agree with every historical claim or not, the deeper challenge lands hard: Christians must learn to ask what kind of story a symbol is telling. A cross calls us to die. A flag calls us to rally. A secret oath calls us to conceal. Those are not small differences. And once we stop treating public life as neutral, we may begin to see how easily spiritual compromise wears respectable clothes.

“This is really the oldest heresy... the same temptation that the serpent tempted Eve with... ‘ye shall be like gods.’” (14:25)

Power loves secrecy, Jesus works in the light

One of the clearest themes in this conversation is that power protects itself. Secret societies, elite networks, and mutual loyalty structures are useful precisely because they shield influence from public accountability. That is one reason the discussion of the Morgan Affair matters so much in the episode. For Scipio, it becomes a case study in how a relatively small group can exercise outsized influence through shared secrecy, political relationships, and cultural fear.

That raises a very Christian question: what kind of kingdom does Jesus build? Not one held together by hidden handshakes, blood oaths, and carefully managed access. The Kingdom of God moves in truth, confession, mercy, and open proclamation. Jesus says let your yes be yes. Government says keep the inner circle protected. Jesus washes feet. Systems of domination guard the ladder.

“A more perfect agent for the devising and execution of conspiracies against church or state could scarcely have been conceived.” (11:05, quoting Charles Francis Adams)

Why Christians still cling to government

Maybe the most sobering part of the episode is not the discussion of Freemasonry itself. It is the repeated question underneath it: why do Christians keep trusting the very systems that train them away from Jesus? Craig returns more than once to the frustration of seeing believers recognize evil in the abstract, yet continue supporting government in practice. We can spot corruption, but we still want our side to run it.

And that may be the real spiritual danger here. We like visible strength. We like belonging. We like the feeling that if the right people held the levers, things would finally become righteous. But Jesus never told us to seize Caesar and clean him up. He told us to love enemies, tell the truth, reject hypocrisy, and follow Him. That path is slower. It is less glamorous. It gives us less control. Maybe that is why it feels so hard.

False light and true light

Late in the conversation, Craig asks directly about the guest’s claim that Masonic thought points toward Luciferian themes. However listeners hear that part of the discussion, the contrast that follows is deeply Christian and worth sitting with: what counts as light? Is it secret knowledge? Elite access? Self-deification? Or is it Christ Himself, the true Light who enters the world without coercion, spectacle, or domination?

That contrast matters far beyond this topic. Every age has its version of “further light.” New techniques. New access. New power. New ways for humanity to save itself. But Jesus does not offer enlightenment as a ladder for the strong. He offers Himself to the poor in spirit, the meek, the merciful, and the peacemakers. He does not flatter our pride. He crucifies it.

“What do you most desire? Not Christ, but the further light in masonry...” (53:17)

No king but Christ still matters

By the end, the conversation widens back out. Freemasonry may be the subject, but allegiance is the deeper issue. What are we really trusting? What stories have formed us? What are we willing to overlook because the symbols feel familiar and the system feels normal?

This episode does not ask us to become obsessed with hidden things. It asks us to become faithful in plain things. Tell the truth. Refuse idolatry. Be skeptical of power. Measure every claim, symbol, and system against Jesus. If something needs secrecy, coercion, and flattery to survive, it probably does not belong to the Kingdom.

And maybe that is the final invitation here: stop chasing the machinery of government and return to the Lamb. The Church does not need better hidden networks. It needs clearer allegiance.

🤝Connect with Scipio Eruditus🤝

• Substack: Dispatches from Reality — dfreality.substack.com

• YouTube: Dispatches From Reality / @ScipioEruditus

• Podcast: Dispatches from Reality - Narrated (Spotify and Apple Podcasts)

Highlights & Takeaways

• Patriotism can feel holy until lived experience reveals how deeply government depends on myth.

• Hidden rituals and public symbols both disciple people; neither is neutral.

• Jesus builds His Kingdom in truth and light, not secrecy and elite protection.

• The temptation to “be like gods” still shows up anywhere power is pursued apart from God.

• Christians often condemn corruption in theory while still defending it when their tribe benefits.

• “Further light” is a dangerous promise when it pulls us away from Christ, the true Light.

• The real issue is not curiosity about secret societies, but clarity about allegiance.

• No reform of government can replace the call to simple obedience to Jesus.

Listen

Listen for the deeper thread running through the whole conversation: not just Freemasonry, but the way power forms our imagination and teaches us what to trust.

Reflect

Ask yourself where your own loyalties have been shaped more by national myth, institutional respectability, or cultural fear than by the words of Jesus.

Read

Read 2 Thessalonians 2:7, Genesis 3, John 1, and Matthew 5–7. Notice the contrast between mystery, false light, and the way of Christ.

Practice

Take one symbol, slogan, or civic ritual you have always treated as normal, and honestly ask: does this move me closer to the Lamb, or closer to the logic of government?

Episode Timestamps:

(0:00) Opening the question: Freemasonry, Christianity, and the state

• Craig’s curiosity and caution

• Searching for truth beyond documentaries and TV narratives

(1:15) Meeting Scipio Eruditus

• Pseudonym and writing background

• Long-form essays as method

• Entering the subject through research, not spectacle

(2:12) War, patriotism, and the breaking of trust

• Air Force service after 9/11

• Afghanistan as paradigm shift

• Propaganda, freedom-talk, disillusionment

(5:16) Fraternities as a gateway into deeper questions

• Former membership in Fiji Fraternity

• Masonic overlap in ritual and symbolism

• Secret oaths, handshakes, initiation patterns

(6:43) The initiation experience that shook him

• Hooded transport to a lodge

• Sense of dread, evil, spiritual unease

• Checkerboard floor, all-seeing eye, symbols everywhere

(8:28) Freemasonry and the making of the modern world

• History hidden in plain sight

• Influence on the last 300 years

• Mainline scholarship, not just fringe material

(9:24) Patriotism losing its innocence

• “American chauvinist” past

• Scales falling from the eyes

• Constitution and founding myths reconsidered

(10:14) The “mystery” question

• 2 Thessalonians 2 as framing text

• Freemasonry as hidden foundation

• Cornerstones, symbols, and spiritual undercurrents

(11:05) Secret societies and conspiracy against church and state

• Charles Francis Adams quote

• Elite men sworn to secrecy

• Bloody oaths, hierarchy, insulation from accountability

(12:26) Ancient religion, Babylon, and Egypt

• Mystery religion language

• Ritual parallels and symbols

• Ancient rebellion carried forward

(13:32) The unfinished pyramid and “the great work”

• Dollar-bill symbolism

• Human self-perfection apart from God

• Theosis without Christ, rebellion dressed as progress

(14:25) The oldest heresy returns

• Genesis 3 and “ye shall be like gods”

• False light, false liberation

• Christ vs self-divinization

(18:04) Lower ranks, hidden knowledge, and the shield of charity

• “We do good works” defense

• Scouting for the amenable

• Ignorance below the top levels

(29:01) Why such a small group carries so much influence

• Elite appeal, movers and shakers

• Influence on state and Christian imagination

• Surface-level Christianity confronted

(30:30) The Morgan Affair

• Competing public narratives

• Kidnapping and cover-up claims

• John Quincy Adams as outspoken critic

(31:46) Political dominion and suppression of scandal

• Public press influence

• Governors, senators, secret orders

• Small network, outsized power

(34:57) Support the Bad Roman Project

(49:09) Symbols on the currency

• Subtle and bold at once

• Masonic imagery in plain sight

• Public apathy, normalized corruption

(50:39) Allegiance, Lucifer, and false light

• Craig’s question about satanic allegiance

• Digging into Masonic literature

• Albert Pike and the language of light

(53:17) “Further light in masonry”

• Oath language contrasted with Christ

• Morning star imagery

• False knowledge vs true light

(58:58) Is Freemasonry still driving government today?

• Influence changing form

• Other occult groups taking cultural space

• Institution fading, deeper logic remaining

(59:17) Can Christians make government righteous?

• Voting to “improve” Caesar

• State reform vs Kingdom fidelity

• The limits of political salvation

(1:12:20) Where to find Scipio’s work

• Dispatches from Reality on Substack

• Weekly roundups and long-form essays

• YouTube: @ScipioEruditus

• Podcast: Dispatches from Reality - Narrated (Spotify and Apple Podcasts)

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131. Military Service and God’s Will: A Veteran’s Journey with Steve O'Connor

About this Episode

In this eye-opening episode of the Bad Roman Podcast, host Craig Harguess sits down with Steve O'Connor, a former Marine who shares his powerful journey from military service to embracing a Christ-centered life. Steve's story challenges conventional wisdom about patriotism, military service, and what it truly means to follow Jesus.

The Allure of Military Service

Steve's path to the military was paved with family tradition and societal expectations. Growing up in a family with deep military roots, he was captivated by the idea of serving his country from a young age. The events of 9/11 further solidified his resolve to join the armed forces.

"I wasn't a great student and so they, they always say, oh well, you know, if you're not great in school, the military is perfect place for you," Steve recalls. This common narrative, coupled with family pride and a desire to defend his country, led him to enlist in the Marine Corps.

Key Insight: Many young people are drawn to military service through a combination of family expectations, societal pressure, and a genuine desire to serve. However, this decision often comes without a full understanding of the implications.

The Reality of Military Life

Steve's experiences in the military were far from the romanticized version often portrayed in recruitment ads. He deployed three times in four years, missing significant milestones in his family life, including the birth of his son. The physical and emotional toll was immense:

• Broken back

• Dislocated shoulders

• Knee injuries

• Sleep apnea

• PTSD and anxiety

"I scream at night. I don't remember my dreams," Steve shares, highlighting the lasting impact of his service.

Challenge: Veterans often struggle with the disconnect between their expectations of military service and the harsh realities they face. This can lead to profound physical and emotional challenges that persist long after their service ends.

A Spiritual Awakening

The turning point in Steve's journey came during a Memorial Day celebration in 2017. As he recited the Pledge of Allegiance, he had a sudden realization:

"I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America. And I said that first line, I was like, what? In my brain, I'm just like, what in the hell am I doing? What is this garbage I am saying?"

This moment sparked a deep reevaluation of his beliefs and values, leading Steve to question the relationship between his faith and his allegiance to the state.

Key Takeaway: True spiritual growth often requires us to challenge deeply ingrained beliefs and societal norms. Steve's experience shows how a single moment of clarity can set in motion a profound transformation.

Redefining Patriotism and Faith

As Steve delved deeper into the teachings of Jesus, he began to see a stark contrast between Christ's message of peace and love and the violence inherent in military service. He came to a powerful conclusion:

"God does not want your son [or daughter] joining the military”

This realization has led Steve to approach conversations about military service with honesty and a focus on the teachings of Christ. He now sees his role as helping others, especially young people considering or in military service, to understand the full implications of that choice.

Practical Advice: When discussing military service with others, especially young people, Steve aims to:

1. Be honest about the physical and emotional toll of service

2. Encourage reflection on how military service aligns (or doesn't) with one's faith and values

3. Present alternative ways to serve one's community and country

The Ongoing Journey

Steve's transformation is still a work in progress. He grapples with how to live out his newfound convictions in a community deeply entrenched in military culture. His story serves as a powerful reminder that true faith often requires us to challenge societal norms and expectations.

What We Learned About Faith, Patriotism, and Service

Steve's journey from soldier to peacemaker offers valuable lessons for all of us:

1. Question societal norms: Don't accept traditional narratives about patriotism and service without critical examination.

2. Align actions with beliefs: Regularly evaluate whether your actions truly reflect your core values and faith.

3. Embrace transformation: Be open to changing long-held beliefs when confronted with new insights or spiritual growth.

4. Share your story: Your experiences, even (or especially) the challenging ones, can help others navigate their own journeys.

Steve's story challenges us to reconsider what it truly means to serve God and our fellow humans. It reminds us that sometimes, the most patriotic act is to question and challenge the status quo in pursuit of a more peaceful, Christ-centered world.

Are you ready to reevaluate your own beliefs about patriotism, service, and faith? Listen to the full episode to dive deeper into Steve's transformative journey and discover how it might inspire changes in your own life.

Episode Timestamps:

(0:53) Steve's background and military service

• Family history of military service

• Influence of 9/11 on Steve's decision to join the military

• Multiple deployments to Iraq and Afghanistan

(5:20) Steve's religious background and conversion

• Raised with mixed Catholic and Christian Science influences

• Became a Christian through his wife's influence

(7:27) Steve's military career and deployments

• Three tours in four years as intelligence personnel

• Experiences in combat and military operations

• Reference to Generation Kill (HBO Series)

(11:48) Steve's awakening to the issues with military service

• Realization during a Memorial Day celebration in 2017

• Recognition of the American flag as a "golden calf"

(14:09) Discussion on current military recruitment challenges

• Declining recruitment numbers and possible reasons

• Steve's perspective on the lack of active conflicts

(21:23) Steve's struggle with past actions and beliefs

• Grappling with the idea that military service wasn't God's will

• Impact on mental health and PTSD

• Reference to 1st Samuel 8 (Bible Verse)

(29:13) Steve's family life and the impact of military service

• Missing his son's birth during deployment

• Challenges in reconnecting with family after long absences

(42:52) Conversations with others about military service

• Approach to discussing military realities with potential recruits

• Balancing honesty about hardships with respect for beliefs

(50:36) Steve's evolving perspective on patriotism and symbolism

• Discomfort with excessive flag displays and national anthems

• Recognizing the brainwashing aspect of patriotic rituals

• Blue Angels are still cool though

(59:36) Conclusion and future plans

• Encouragement for Steve to start writing about his experiences

• Potential for future discussions on the podcast.

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From Soldier to Peacemaker: A Veteran's Journey Towards Faith and Justice with Joe Chadburn

About this Episode

Welcome to another episode of the Bad Roman podcast, where we examine the line between faith and statecraft. Join your host Craig Harguess to welcome well-decorated and honorably discharged US Marine Corps veteran Joe Chadburn, who has traversed the path from violence to peace, and uses the power of Christ as his compass. Together, we unpack the transformation of a bullied kid into a soldier, and how the teachings of Jesus Christ are brought about a sea-change in his perceptions.

In a society often marred by violence, Joe exemplifies the peaceful path, highlighting the power of 'no' as a guide. Together, we'll dissect the peaceful principles inherent in Jesus Christ's teachings and how the early church embraced these values. As we dive into Christianity, our discussion aims to refresh your perspective on its doctrines.

We investigate the propaganda that surrounds the US military, the churches’ direct role in perpetuating the cycle, and the misuse of tax dollars funneled into militarization. We reflect upon the legacy of General Smithly D Butler and the impact of grassroots efforts to protest against racial injustice. The military-industrial complex, the biggest polluter on Earth, is scrutinized - unveiling the significance of comprehending Jesus' teachings to prevent more human suffering.

We're not afraid to point out the privilege of the United States and its part in global injustice. The atrocities in Yemen and the complicity of the US government come under our lens, revealing a lack of media coverage and accountability. Hear from our guest as he expresses his frustrations with the multi-tiered justice system and the influence of corporate media in manipulating narratives.

We wrap up on an optimistic note, exploring the power of storytelling, human connection, and technology in addressing global injustice and promoting peace. Join us on this enlightening journey, and let's reimagine our world together.

Joe Chadburn

Website: International Peace Network

Email: peacedaddyjoe@gmail.com

Podcast: Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Youtube

Joe’s Article: War is a Racket

Episode Timestamps:

01:20 Christians in the State (12 Minutes)

• No King but Christ Network

• The article he wrote called 'War is a Racket Racket

03:11 Who is Joe Chadburn

• Early childhood tragedies and bullying

• Relationship to violence as a youth

• Journey to becoming a decorated US Marine Corps Veteran

• Journey to Jesus 

• Political propganda of venterans 

11:04 Joe’s Military Service

• Anti-war efforts from those who have served

15:03 Joe’s Article - War is a Racket from International Peace Network

• Contentious objectors

• Connection to walking with Jesus

• Stereotypes and real-world relationships

•  Double standards of USA military imperialism throughout the world

• Bullying

• “How dare these people put their countries by our military bases”

• Business of war - supply and demand

22:31 Critiquing the US Military and Propaganda

• Politicians exploitation of young people 

• Military demonstrations at sporting events

• Military flyovers in football games

• Colin Kaepernick

• Grassroots peace movement

• Major General Smedley Butler

• From hero to disgruntled capitalist pawn

• The fallacy of “nation-building”

• US Military recruiting trends

29:55 Collusion of American Churches and the Military

• how the church in the United States has perpetuated and normalized war propaganda in direct contradiction to Jesus' teachings 

• importance of a proper hermeneutic to understanding Jesus' teachings and the significance of understanding the wars and rumors of wars that Jesus was prophesying about 

• Challenging the idea that war is inevitable, and highlighting the power of cruciform love in Jesus' example.

• how the military-industrial complex is the biggest polluter on Earth and how we must take Jesus' teachings seriously to prevent more people from suffering

• Meaning of peace – not the absence of conflict

• Do we believe God failed?

• If you wouldn’t do it yourself, why do you want your tax dollars going toward it?

• War is the language of idiots

42:18 American Privilege and Global Injustice 

• how debates about American politics can obscure deeper concerns about global injustice

• The greatest generation should be the one with the most peace

• US government's use of Nazi war criminals and the bank's funding of Hitler

• need to recognize the privilege of the United States and to advocate for those who are suffering due to US policy

44:14 - Media Distraction, Global Atrocities, and American Privilege

• Yemen

• Frustration with the multi-tiered justice system and the ease with which people are distracted by insignificant topics 

• Need to pay attention to the deeper stories behind wars and the influence of corporate media in controlling the narrative

• Importance of seeking news from a wide range of sources to gain a broader perspective on current events 

• Don’t forget joy in the face of negativity

• The grace of God

54:16 - Promoting Peace and Friendship Overseas

• Power of technology to tell stories of oppression and the importance of making meaningful connections with people who don't look or think like you 

• consequences of the US ticking people off around the world and how peace can be achieved by being a peacemaker and a lover of humanity

• Power in the grace of god 

56:56 How saying 'No' to military propaganda, recruiters, and politicians can bring about world peace

• Share with others what is going on

59:50 Continue the conversation

• International Peace Network

• peacedaddyjoe@gmail.com

• No King but Christ Network

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