From Soldier to Peacemaker: A Veteran's Journey Towards Faith and Justice with Joe Chadburn

About this Episode

Welcome to another episode of the Bad Roman podcast, where we examine the line between faith and statecraft. Join your host Craig Harguess to welcome well-decorated and honorably discharged US Marine Corps veteran Joe Chadburn, who has traversed the path from violence to peace, and uses the power of Christ as his compass. Together, we unpack the transformation of a bullied kid into a soldier, and how the teachings of Jesus Christ are brought about a sea-change in his perceptions.

In a society often marred by violence, Joe exemplifies the peaceful path, highlighting the power of 'no' as a guide. Together, we'll dissect the peaceful principles inherent in Jesus Christ's teachings and how the early church embraced these values. As we dive into Christianity, our discussion aims to refresh your perspective on its doctrines.

We investigate the propaganda that surrounds the US military, the churches’ direct role in perpetuating the cycle, and the misuse of tax dollars funneled into militarization. We reflect upon the legacy of General Smithly D Butler and the impact of grassroots efforts to protest against racial injustice. The military-industrial complex, the biggest polluter on Earth, is scrutinized - unveiling the significance of comprehending Jesus' teachings to prevent more human suffering.

We're not afraid to point out the privilege of the United States and its part in global injustice. The atrocities in Yemen and the complicity of the US government come under our lens, revealing a lack of media coverage and accountability. Hear from our guest as he expresses his frustrations with the multi-tiered justice system and the influence of corporate media in manipulating narratives.

We wrap up on an optimistic note, exploring the power of storytelling, human connection, and technology in addressing global injustice and promoting peace. Join us on this enlightening journey, and let's reimagine our world together.

Joe Chadburn

Website: International Peace Network

Email: peacedaddyjoe@gmail.com

Podcast: Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Youtube

Joe’s Article: War is a Racket

Episode Timestamps:

01:20 Christians in the State (12 Minutes)

• No King but Christ Network

• The article he wrote called 'War is a Racket Racket

03:11 Who is Joe Chadburn

• Early childhood tragedies and bullying

• Relationship to violence as a youth

• Journey to becoming a decorated US Marine Corps Veteran

• Journey to Jesus 

• Political propganda of venterans 

11:04 Joe’s Military Service

• Anti-war efforts from those who have served

15:03 Joe’s Article - War is a Racket from International Peace Network

• Contentious objectors

• Connection to walking with Jesus

• Stereotypes and real-world relationships

•  Double standards of USA military imperialism throughout the world

• Bullying

• “How dare these people put their countries by our military bases”

• Business of war - supply and demand

22:31 Critiquing the US Military and Propaganda

• Politicians exploitation of young people 

• Military demonstrations at sporting events

• Military flyovers in football games

• Colin Kaepernick

• Grassroots peace movement

• Major General Smedley Butler

• From hero to disgruntled capitalist pawn

• The fallacy of “nation-building”

• US Military recruiting trends

29:55 Collusion of American Churches and the Military

• how the church in the United States has perpetuated and normalized war propaganda in direct contradiction to Jesus' teachings 

• importance of a proper hermeneutic to understanding Jesus' teachings and the significance of understanding the wars and rumors of wars that Jesus was prophesying about 

• Challenging the idea that war is inevitable, and highlighting the power of cruciform love in Jesus' example.

• how the military-industrial complex is the biggest polluter on Earth and how we must take Jesus' teachings seriously to prevent more people from suffering

• Meaning of peace – not the absence of conflict

• Do we believe God failed?

• If you wouldn’t do it yourself, why do you want your tax dollars going toward it?

• War is the language of idiots

42:18 American Privilege and Global Injustice 

• how debates about American politics can obscure deeper concerns about global injustice

• The greatest generation should be the one with the most peace

• US government's use of Nazi war criminals and the bank's funding of Hitler

• need to recognize the privilege of the United States and to advocate for those who are suffering due to US policy

44:14 - Media Distraction, Global Atrocities, and American Privilege

• Yemen

• Frustration with the multi-tiered justice system and the ease with which people are distracted by insignificant topics 

• Need to pay attention to the deeper stories behind wars and the influence of corporate media in controlling the narrative

• Importance of seeking news from a wide range of sources to gain a broader perspective on current events 

• Don’t forget joy in the face of negativity

• The grace of God

54:16 - Promoting Peace and Friendship Overseas

• Power of technology to tell stories of oppression and the importance of making meaningful connections with people who don't look or think like you 

• consequences of the US ticking people off around the world and how peace can be achieved by being a peacemaker and a lover of humanity

• Power in the grace of god 

56:56 How saying 'No' to military propaganda, recruiters, and politicians can bring about world peace

• Share with others what is going on

59:50 Continue the conversation

• International Peace Network

• peacedaddyjoe@gmail.com

• No King but Christ Network

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78. The Role of Propaganda in Abusive Relationships with Derek Kreider

About this Episode

Derek Kreider, host of pacifist podcast “The Fourth Way,” joins Craig for a discussion on his latest season about propaganda. What is propaganda? Who propagandizes? And what benefits do they receive from doing so? From personal relationships, church institutions and the state, propaganda plays a part in how people organise themselves and Derek and Craig discuss them all.

The conversation starts with institutionalised abuse within the Southern Baptist Convention and how poorly churches deal with allegations of sexual abuse. Every year allegations of sexual misconduct are the church’s biggest problem. Even higher-ups who are not abusers are incentivized to cover up for underlings abusing their authority to keep the money flowing. We also learn that propaganda is not just what is communicated, but also includes leaving out important information, in this case to avoid “tarnishing God’s reputation” or other reasonable-sounding excuses.

Next, they discuss state propaganda. The state is basically an abuser who feels the need to control through the usual methods: charisma, controlling the flow of information and if these things fail then resorting to violence. Finally, Craig gets vulnerable about his abusive second marriage, the isolation and altercations, ending the episode with a note of hope for those who believe they are stuck in a situation of domestic violence: it is possible to escape.

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Episode Timestamps:

3:08 - Who is Derek Kreider?

• Raised conservative with Christian education

• Likes apologetics

• Currently in Romania as a missionary

4:22 – What is causing the rise in atheism? 

• Institutionalising religion ruins it

• There’s a lot of people leaving the church in America, but it’s the institutions they are leaving

• Church could also be people gathered in Jesus’ name

9:19 – The Fourth Way Podcast

• 2016 and the election of Donald Trump made Derek want to start a podcast

• The ends don’t justify the means, but the evangelical community tried to justify Trump’s actions

• Consequentialism

• Watched a video on pacifism

• Pacifism works better than grasping for power in the political realm

• Made the podcast to explore his own Christian reasoning

• The name comes from Walter Wink’s “The Third Way” but Pacifism is a fourth way, not fight, flight or freeze, but being active in pacifism

• Families who allow their loved ones killers live on death row rather than have them killed have changed those people

• Pacifism requires a whole lot more creativity to solve problems

• It brings the humanity back to the killer 

• There is nothing in the writings of the early church that indicate they were not pacifists

20:06 – What’s happening with the Southern Baptists?

• Recently it has come to light that some of their prominent leaders have abused people and other leaders have covered it up

• Then asked others to be silent about it

• Rachael Denhollander – What is a Girl Worth?

• Famous for coming forward after being abused by a doctor

• Talks about how terrible the church was at dealing with that

• Became an advocate for abuse within the Southern Baptist Church

• Although it’s not specific to the Southern Baptist Church

• Sexual allegations are the biggest problems for church every year

• When people take advantage of their positions of authority it doesn’t look like Jesus

• There should not be flawed human beings being given power in the church

• “It shall not be so among you”

• Individuals must take personal responsibility for their actions

• A lot of times power ends up corrupting people

• The Southern Baptist Convention also had leadership that covered up abuse

• In order to keep their own power

• So they don’t loose funding or control

• Do it in the name of Jesus – don’t want Him to look bad

• This is simple consequentialism

• After studying conspiracies for a year Derek thinks lots of people can hide a conspiracy

• This is not a uniquely church thing, people are corrupt

• A new structure would be full of people doing the same thing

• Maybe people are pulling back from the church because it looks just like government politics

• Sometimes members of churches solely blame individuals for problems that may be systemic

• Pastors are celebrities not shepherds, leading to people abusing power

35:09 – Propaganda, the state and abusers

• Politicians are going to go wherever the funding comes from

• This is a structural problem

• Propaganda is 100% intentional

• But its often done by people who are sincere about their cause

• A jerk on a power trip is easier to disbelieve

• Everyone propagandises

• Derek educates his kids therefore by some definitions he propagandises them

• We use the word for education that we don’t like

• In the Southern Baptists the higher-ups silence the news media that’s also propaganda

• Because it shapes your understanding

• The higher-ups say they prefer to highlight the good and leave out the bad

• It’s propaganda to leave information out

• Its an intricate web of self-justification and gaslighting

• Trump was worse on the second amendment than Obama

• Jacques Ellul – Propaganda and The Technological Society

• Propaganda produces extreme polarization

• And other quotes that could have been written yesterday

• Propaganda seeks to isolate individuals

• Repeats simple content

• Creates a problem to resolve then offers itself as a saviour

• Abusers do the same thing

• Craig’s second marriage was abusive like this

• Derek’s episode about marital abuse: Propaganda and Domestic Abusers

• You can escape an abusive relationship and God won’t be offended

• Things escalate when the abuser feels like they are out of control

• Craig’s second wife threw knives and had him arrested

• Then moved in next door when he left

• Its different in every situation

• David Graber – The Dawn of Everything

• Talks about how the state functions

• The state is basically an abuser who needs control

• Violence is risky but effective if you are stronger

• Information can also be used to control

• Charisma can be used to control others, this is the most effective

• States work like this too, when charisma (stories) stops working then they try manipulation then violence

• Abusers isolate their victims

1:00:21 – The conspiracy of corporatism

• How do we discern truth and how are beliefs formed?

• How was propaganda implemented?

• A 70 episode series on propaganda could have been much larger

• Corporations and businesses propaganda

• How do they do it?

• What effect does it have?

• What should you look out for?

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