152. Did Government Authority Justify the Killing of Renee Nicole Good? A Christian View with Larken Rose

Was the shooting of a Christian mother of three, Renee Nicole Good, murder or self-defense? When Christians cheer for state violence, can we claim it is God we actually worship?

Craig sits down with author and provocateur Larken Rose, not to tally clips or dunk on strangers online, but to face a deeper sickness: our culture’s worship of “authority.” The story that played out on an icy street – ICE agents, a woman in a car, three bullets – exposes something far older than any badge. It exposes a rival religion. In that light, this episode is not merely commentary. It’s a mirror for the American church and a call to return to the Sermon on the Mount. 

A House Divided: Flag or Cross?

Followers of Jesus have always had to choose between two rival kingdoms. One hangs its hope on power, control, and the threat of punishment. The other takes up a cross and washes feet. One calls enemies “targets.” The other calls enemies “neighbors.” When a woman is shot through a car window by an agent of the state, the first kingdom asks whether the procedures were followed. The second asks whether love of neighbor has been abandoned.

Many Christians don’t like that contrast. It feels unfair, even accusatory. But the Gospels force the question. Jesus blesses peacemakers, not power-brokers. He rebukes the sword. He refuses to call down fire. He walks through Samaria instead of around it. He tells us that the way we treat the least of these is the way we treat Him.

If that is the King we confess, then any event involving state violence is not just a legal question; it’s a discipleship question. What we defend in public reveals what we worship in private. When a badge is enough to change our moral standard, we have traded the Kingdom for the empire and slapped Jesus’ name on it. That is not orthodoxy. That is idolatry.

What Actually Happened Matters, but Why We Defend It Matters More

Yes, facts matter. Video matters. Angles matter. In this case, people argue over the “first shot” like it’s a courtroom riddle, then skip past the unarguable reality of two more shots fired into a vehicle at a woman who posed no lethal threat. Some admit those facts and then slip into the great American shrug: if the state did it, it must be justified. That reflex is the problem.

Larken names it without blinking: the belief in authority trains ordinary people to excuse evil when their team does it. That is not a left-versus-right issue. It is a worship issue. You can hear it whenever someone says, “Well, she should have obeyed,” as if obedience to a man with a gun is identical to obedience to God. You see it whenever the conversation dodges the moral center, “You shall not murder,” “love your neighbor as yourself,” “blessed are the merciful,” and runs to procedures, politics, and public relations.

The church must refuse that dodge. The Kingdom does not baptize bullets because the shooter is wearing a government costume. The cross does not create exceptions for uniforms. If something is murder without a badge, it is still murder with a badge.

Badges Don’t Make New Morals

Imagine this scene without uniforms. Masked, armed men surround your car, try doors, yell commands, and one of them moves into the lane in front of your hood. If any gang behaved like this, nearly everyone would call it reckless, immoral, and criminal. So why, when the label reads “federal agent,” do some believers flip their ethics upside down? The answer is ugly: many of us believe the state has divine permission to do evil that would be evil for anyone else. We won’t say it that bluntly, but our defenses give it away.

Scripture gives us no such permission. Romans 13 cannot be read against Romans 12 or the Sermon on the Mount. Paul does not cancel Jesus. The early church did not arm itself with Caesar’s sword to spread the Gospel. The fathers we quote on holiness would laugh at the idea that a title grants moral immunity. “No King but Christ” means one moral law for everyone, from the poor to the powerful. Anything else is a golden calf in red, white, and blue paint.

This is why arguments about “procedure” miss the point. Procedures do not create righteousness. Policy manuals do not erase the image of God. If the second and third shots cannot be reconciled with neighbor-love, then they cannot be reconciled with the way of Christ. Period.

Milgram in the Pew: How Training Beats Conscience

Why do otherwise decent people defend what they know is wrong? Larken points to the Milgram experiments for a grim answer. In those studies, ordinary participants believed they were shocking strangers. They trembled. They begged to stop. They knew it was wrong. But a man in a lab coat told them to continue, and their training overpowered their conscience.

The details differ, but the mechanism is the same. Our culture trains us to obey official voices and to distrust our own moral sight. We are deputized by television dramas, press conferences, and patriotic ceremonies until our instinct is to side with uniforms and treat victims as problems. Christians are not immune. We should be. We have a King who heals the ear of His enemy in a garden and rebukes the disciple holding the blade. Yet our formation is often more Fox, CNN, and campaign season than Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John.

Repentance here looks like deprogramming. It looks like reading Scripture as if Jesus actually meant it. It looks like confessing that we’ve excused evil because it felt safe and our team was in charge. It looks like choosing to say out loud, “That was wrong,” even when our political friends frown. In Milgram’s study, the moment one person refused, many others found courage to stop too. The Church can be that person, that voice, that pause button on cruelty.

Tactics Are Not Morals

Some Christians try to solve their discomfort by shifting the conversation: “Maybe she shouldn’t have been there.” “Maybe she should have complied.” “Maybe she should have driven away faster… or slower.” You can say a choice was unwise. You can coach your kids on better tactics when approached by armed men. But none of that baptizes murder. None of it justifies bullets.

The moral center does not move with our tactical advice. Wisdom can help us survive a sinful world; it cannot make sin righteous. When we talk about tactics to avoid talking about morals, we confess our idolatry. We tell on ourselves. We admit that we want to protect the system more than we want to protect the weak.

A healthier church would tell a different story. It would grieve a life lost. It would comfort a neighborhood. It would ask whether our habits and budgets make this kind of violence more likely. It would bless the peacemakers and retrain the reflexes that cheer for force. It would teach children that bravery looks like stepping out of the cycle of retaliation, not doubling down on it.

What the Church Should Have Said

If pastors and Christian leaders had been formed by the Sermon on the Mount, the first public words after the video surfaced would have been simple:

• “This is a tragedy. We grieve with the family.”

• “A badge does not change the image of God in a victim.”

• “Even if procedures were followed, that does not make it moral.”

• “We will not baptize state violence. We will not slander the dead.”

• “We call our people to peacemaking, not to performative outrage.”

Instead, many Christians ran interference for power. Some called the dead a terrorist. Some cherry-picked statutes. Some mocked the neighbors recording the scene. Some asked “Have you not learned?” like a playground bully, as if the point of government is to frighten the populace into submission. This language betrays a different savior. It teaches a different gospel. The cross is replaced by the sword, the pastor’s stole by the riot shield.

We can do better. We must do better. Not to score points against an agency, but to keep our own souls.

The Oldest Lie in Politics: “We’re the Good Guys”

Both major parties baptize violence when it suits their platform. The rhetoric changes. The victims change. The television graphics change. The machine does not. Larken testifies that he too once wore the stickers, cheered the raids, and trusted the system. Many of us did. Repentance looks like telling the truth about that past and refusing to repeat it. It looks like saying, out loud, “I was wrong,” then learning to see our neighbors again without the costume of ideology.

This is not cynicism. It is Christian realism. Jesus did not trust Himself to the crowds because He knew what was in man. He knew the appetite for power would twist even “good policy” into coercion. He knew fear could turn worshipers into executioners. He knew that the devil’s offer, “all the kingdoms of the world if you will bow,” still tempts believers today. That is why He called us to a narrow road.

Constitutions, Laws, and the Kingdom That Outlasts Them

Some listeners want the constitutional angle. Even there, the ground is shaky. The federal charter lists enumerated powers. It does not list a police power to regulate every person’s movement under threat of death. But the deeper Christian point is prior to all constitutions. Even if a law allowed an immoral act, it would not cease to be immoral.

The early Christians didn’t need a bill of rights to love enemies, rescue the vulnerable, and refuse idolatry. They needed a Lord. We have the same Lord. Our public discipleship should look like it.

The Kingdom Answer: Neighbor Love With Skin On

If our loyalty is to the crucified King, our answer is not primarily a hot take. Our answer is a way of life. It looks like walking toward those who are hurting. It looks like letting the doctor check a pulse instead of blocking him with the threat of pepper spray. It looks like telling truth over team loyalty. It looks like Christians becoming the people who can be trusted in a crisis because they are too busy serving to score points.

It also looks like refusing to dehumanize the agents who pulled the trigger. That does not mean excusing evil. It means telling the truth about the act while refusing to hate the actor. It means praying for justice and for their repentance. It means knowing that the same training that crushed a conscience on a street has also numbed consciences in our pews.

The way forward is not complicated, but it is costly: lay down the idolatry of political saviors and take up the cross. Pray for the courage to refuse wicked orders at every level of society. Become a people who would rather lose a platform than lose our soul.

Scripture Trail for the Church Today

• Matthew 5–7: Jesus’ constitution for the Kingdom. Peacemakers. Mercy. Enemy-love. No exceptions for uniforms.

• Romans 12 before Romans 13: Love without hypocrisy. Bless persecutors. Overcome evil with good. Read Chapter 13 in the light of Chapter 12.

• Psalm 146: Do not put your trust in princes. Their plans perish. God guards the sojourner.

• John 4; Luke 10: Jesus walks through Samaria; the neighbor is the one who shows mercy.

Let Scripture reform the reflexes shaped by talk radio and campaign seasons. Let your imagination be drenched in the Kingdom, not the headlines.

Listen & Reflect

🎧 Listen: Anywhere you find your podcasts
💬 Ask: When you see a badge, do you change your moral standard? What does that reveal about your discipleship?
📖 Read: Matthew 5–7; Romans 12–13; Psalm 146; Luke 10.
🤝 Practice: This week, serve a neighbor with no questions asked. No status check. No proof. Just love that acts.

Highlights & Takeaways

• A badge does not create a new morality. Jesus does not grant exceptions for uniforms.

• If you defend the first shot, you still must explain the others. You cannot. The second and third shots indict the soul of our authority-worship.

• Milgram wasn’t a myth. Training often beats conscience. Discipleship must train the conscience to fear God more than men.

• “Tactically unwise” is not a synonym for “deserved death.” Stop shifting the target.

• Romans 13 does not cancel the Sermon on the Mount. The cross judges empire, not the other way around.

• “No King but Christ” means one standard of love for everyone—from the poor to the powerful.

🤝Connect with Larken ROSE:

• The Jones Plantation Film

  • Platforms: Available on Apple TV, Amazon Prime, Tubi, Xmou Play, The Roku Channel, PLEX 

• The Rose Channel

• Book: The Most Dangerous Superstition 

• YouTube

• Candles in the Dark

• Facebook

Episode Timestamps:

(00:00) Framing the question: murder or self-defense? Larken returns for “Swearing Sunday.” 

• Christian allegiance vs. state power.

• Moral frame; allegiance check

• Matthew 5–7; Romans 12

• murder vs self-defense; authority; “No King but Christ”

• Previous Episodes with Larken Rose:

• EP #83 The Cult of Statism with Larken Rose

• EP #91 Breaking Down the Jones Plantation Film with Larken Rose

• EP #134 Larken Rose on Immigration and Christian Values: Challenging the Border Fetish Brigade

(00:41) Banter and burden: 

• The week’s exhaustion and why it still matters to speak.

• Choosing faithfulness over comfort; stewardship of voice

• Jeremiah 20:9

• lament; courage; speak

(01:26) Why people cheer evil: authority myths and plantation logic.

• Authority-worship; compliance culture

• How team colors override conscience

• Milgram Experiments (1963)

• obedience; idolatry; “plantation logic”

• Jones Plantation Movie

(03:40) When evil shows itself, some finally wake up.

• Shock as moral catalyst

• Ephesians 5:11

• exposure; repentance; awakening

(07:01) COVID parallels: neighbors revealed their true loyalties.

• Crisis reveals discipleship

• Romans 12 through Romans 13

• compliance; conscience; neighbor-love

(10:00) Badges and gangs: why morality cannot change with uniforms.

• Uniforms ≠ new morals

• Luke 10; early church witness

• badge; uniform; consistency – one standard for everyone.

(13:00) Craig’s Memphis test: you won’t stop to check a badge when guns are in your face.

• First agent opens the door; second moves in front of the car.

• Threat perception; staged risk

• Use-of-force: imminence

(14:17) “That was murder.” 

• Why shots two and three indict the shooter.

• No imminent threat; lethal overreach

• Matthew 5:21; proportionality

• second shot; third shot; homicide

(16:20) The physician they turned away; the shooter who fled.

• Aid refusal; post-incident flight

• Luke 10 (duty of care)

• physician; pulse check; left scene

(17:40) “Few bad apples?” Where are the good apples denouncing murder.

• Institutional silence; complicity

• Proverbs 31:8–9

• accountability; culture; complicity

(20:00) “Have you not learned?” Obedience by threat is not freedom.

• Intimidation ≠ authority

• Acts 5:29

• coercion; threat; tyranny

(21:15) Milgram: training vs. conscience and why people excuse murder.

• Training overrides conscience

• Milgram Experiments (1963) obedience study

• obedience; conditioning; conscience

(24:13) No other gods: when Christians side with Caesar over Christ.

• State-worship vs Kingdom allegiance

• Exodus 20:3; Matthew 6:24

• idolatry; Caesar; worship

• Laws/titles don’t alter morality

• Sermon on the Mount synthesis

• legalism; morality; authority claims

(33:34) “Was it murder?” clarified.

• No threat posture; face shot

• Self-defense: imminence/necessity

• face shot; no danger; overkill

(34:29) Watch his feet.

• No movement = manufactured “threat”

• Video-analysis heuristic

• feet; staging; false threat

(41:17) Tactics vs. morals: unwise choices don’t justify cages or bullets.

• Prudence ≠ moral guilt

• Romans 12:17–21

• tactics; morals; prudence

(47:17) Bootlicking theology called out.

• Excusing abuse = state worship

• Psalm 146

• princes; loyalty; idolatry

(55:55) Constitutional limits & ICE.

• Enumerated powers; no general police power

• Federalist 45 (Madison) summary

• constitution; federal power; jurisdiction

(1:06:56) Prosecution theater.

• Sacrificial pawn; delay and forget

• Prosecutorial discretion patterns

• show trial; delay; memory

(1:10:04) Signs of moral progress.

• Public conscience awakening

• Culture-shift indicators

• outrage; repentance; awareness

(1:12:37) Keep saying stuff

• Encouragement; close; credits

• Community action; sharing

• keep talking; outro; next steps

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Related Episodes

Related Blog Post

148. What Does the Bible Say About Immigration? Jesus and the Freedom to Move with Chris Polk

Are we looking at immigration through the eyes of Christ—or through the eyes of Caesar? When the news shouts “invasion,” it’s easy to beg the state to “do something.” But what happens when “doing something” looks like masked men, rifles, broken windows, and traumatized children?

Chris Polk joins Craig to make an audacious claim: the enforcement of political borders and restrictions on free movement violate a God-given right—and it’s the worst kind of tyranny because it traps image-bearers in cages both visible and invisible. Along the way, they compare red vs. blue “law and order,” name our cop-aganda, revisit the Good Samaritan, and ask how a so-called “Christian nation” can justify treating neighbors like enemies. No King but Christ.

“No King but Christ” in the Age of ICE

Chris connects the celebration of militarized “safety” in American cities with our appetite for state solutions at the border. We tend to excuse violence if our team authorizes it—and then act shocked when that same power is used against people we like. “Don’t give Republicans power you wouldn’t give Democrats, and don’t give Democrats power you wouldn’t give Republicans,” he says. The target always changes; the machine does not.

“You had a rabid dog in a cage. All that had to happen was the wrong guy open the door.” — Chris

Borders: To Keep Them Out or Keep You In?

From years of trucking across the U.S. and Canada, Chris describes how crossing an imaginary line turned ordinary people into presumed criminals. Over time, he became convinced border theater isn’t mainly about keeping “them” out—it’s about keeping you (and your tax dollars) in. When escape requires permission papers and guns at gates, you’re not free—you’re managed.

A Pocket Translator, a Broken Beetle, and Simple Neighbor Love

When a Cuban couple’s VW broke down on a cross-country drive, Chris used a translate app, a U-Haul trailer, a friend’s shop, and $50 to get them back on the road. No forms. No status checks. Just two humans helping two humans—exactly the sort of “Good Samaritan” moment Jesus insists is the point (Luke 10).

“Purging statism made it simple: here are two image-bearers who need help—so help them.” — Chris

Jesus Walks Through Samaria, Not Around It

John 4 says Jesus “had to” go through Samaria. That line is a rebuke to our border instincts. The scandal isn’t just that a Samaritan can be “good,” it’s that the people we’ve othered are the very neighbors we are commanded to love. A “Christian nation” that cages travelers for paperwork violations should probably stop calling itself Christian—or start acting like Jesus.

“Worst of All Tyranny”: Why Restricting Movement Tops the List

Free speech, self-defense, property, enterprise—when local laws get oppressive, you can often leave. But if the state blocks your exit with walls and rifles, every other right becomes conditional. That’s why Chris calls border enforcement “the worst tyranny”: it converts neighbors into suspects and converts freedom into a permission slip.

“Freedom is a choice. The minute you start asking for permission, you’re not free.” — Chris

Cop-aganda, Qualified Immunity, and Our Appetite for Violence

From prestige police dramas to viral chases, we’ve been catechized to cheer when “the good guys” break the rules. That appetite dulls us to real-world flashbangs in the wrong crib and windows shattered over paperwork. Remove the masks and rifles, Chris argues, and most ‘immigration enforcement’ looks like what it is: bureaucratic punishment of the poor.

Would Jesus “Follow the Law”?

When Christians insist Jesus would comply with immigration law, Chris counters with the Gospels: Jesus repeatedly defied bad laws and religious power structures, and His crucifixion is the ultimate divine “No” to state violence. If Mary and Joseph fled Herod today, many of us would demand their papers.

Blowback Is Inevitable

Trauma begets retaliation. Raid families today; reap instability tomorrow. Ron Paul called it “blowback.” Jesus called it sowing and reaping. The Kingdom calls us to another harvest.

Listen & Reflect

🎧 Listen: What stories or Scriptures challenged your default settings on borders?
💬 Reflect: Where have you trusted state power to do what only sacrificial love can do?
📖 Read: John 4 (Jesus and Samaria) and Luke 10 (the Good Samaritan).
🤝 Practice: This week, meet a neighbor across a language or legal line and choose to serve.

Highlights & Takeaways

• A “Christian nation” cannot justify caging image-bearers over paperwork and still call it Christian.

• Border enforcement that restricts movement is uniquely tyrannical because it prevents escape from lesser tyrannies.

• Both parties feed the same machine; swapping mascots doesn’t sanctify state violence.

• Personal stories beat political scripts: neighbor love looks like towing a car, not checking a visa.

• Jesus walks through Samaria; He doesn’t enforce our fences.

• Cop-aganda forms our desires; qualified immunity shields abuses—bad discipleship all around.

• “Would Jesus follow the law?” Not when the law crushes the least of these.

• Expect blowback: raids today sow resentment and future violence.

• Freedom isn’t a permit; it’s a posture. Asking permission is the first surrender.

• No King but Christ means our loyalty to the Kingdom trumps allegiance to the flag.

🤝Connect with Chris Polk:

• Blue Ribbon Logistics Website

• Blue Ribbon's YouTube, Facebook, TikTok

• Previous Bad Roman Episodes with Chris

  • Lessons from the Trucking Industry with Chris Polk (Episode #77)

  • Home School: 2021 Year-End Round Table (Episode #47)

  • Your Rights with Chris Polk & Jacob Daniel (Episode #38)

  • God's Country or Jesus’s Kingdom? Navigating the Nexus of Nationalism and Faith in America (Episode #99)

Episode Timestamps:

(00:10) Framing the Question: Christ vs. Caesar

• Craig frames the episode: immigration through Christ’s lens vs. the state’s lens.

• Guest intro: trucker, entrepreneur, “cat lady and salsa maker,” returning friend Chris Polk.

• The Memphis “safety” surge: why we cheer militarized policing when it’s our team.

(04:00) The Machine Called “Do Something”

• “Do something!”, the spell of monopoly violence.

• ICE didn’t start yesterday; every administration fed the dog.

• Why team-politics blinds us to the machine itself.

(10:30) Fear Cycles & Border Theater

• “Invasion” talk and television fear cycles.

• Chris’ border-crossing years: from license checks to X-rays and suspicion.

• Treating travelers like criminals for an imaginary line.

(18:00) Borders as Cages (Keeping You In)

• Borders as cages: not to keep them out, but to keep you (and your taxes) in.

• COVID era proof: the state’s first instinct is control, not care.

(23:00) The Cuban VW & Neighbor Love

• The Cuban VW story: translate app, trailer, a friend’s shop, and neighbor love.

• Tech as a bridge; statism as a barrier.

(27:00) Jesus Through Samaria

• Jesus had to go through Samaria (John 4).

• Reframing “Good Samaritan” as “Good Immigrant” to expose our prejudice.

(35:00) The Worst Tyranny: Blocking Movement

• Why restricting movement is “the worst tyranny.”

• You can flee bad local laws—unless the state blocks the exit.

(44:00) When “Our Guys” Get Power

• From Jefferson to the Alien & Sedition Acts: power corrupts “our guys,” too.

• States, courts, and the myth that legality equals righteousness.

(50:00) Cop-aganda & Qualified Immunity

• Cop-aganda and qualified immunity: how entertainment disciples us to cheer abuse.

• There’s a better way: summons and due process instead of masks and rifles.

(57:00) Would Jesus “Follow the Law”?

• “Would Jesus follow the law?”why the Gospel answers “not when the law crushes the least.”

• A Time to Kill moment: now imagine the detained family is yours.

(1:02:00) Sowing Violence, Reaping Blowback

• Trauma and blowback: violence begets violence.

• Turning from fear toward faithful neighbor love.

 (1:08:00) Repentance, Friendship, & “No King but Christ”

•  How friendships changed our minds: growth, humility, and leaving team idolatry.

•  Closing plugs and “No King but Christ.”

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Related Episodes

Related Blog Post

134. Larken Rose on Immigration and Christian Values: Challenging the Border Fetish Brigade

What happens when immigration policies clash with Christian values? Craig sits down with Larken Rose to dissect the complexities of immigration, focusing on the criticisms of past and current policies across administrations, what is novel about Trump’s border approach, and the inconsistencies in how some Christians approach these issues. The conversation challenges listeners to scrutinize their beliefs and the language surrounding immigration.

Key Topics:

1. Demonization of Immigrants Under Trump: Larken Rose highlights how Trump's administration has intensified the demonization of immigrants, creating a category of "undesirables." He draws parallels to historical tyrants who gained power by instilling fear of a common enemy. 

2. Libertarian Inconsistencies: The discussion shifts to Dave Smith, a libertarian figure who supports Trump's immigration policies. Larken criticizes libertarians who abandon their principles on immigration, pointing out the hypocrisy in supporting authoritarian measures while claiming to champion individual liberty.

3. Christian Perspectives on Immigration Laws: Christians’ support for harsh immigration policies and "Jesus would follow the law" are examined. Do such stances contradict Jesus' teachings?

4. Self-Reflection and Consistency: Larken concludes with a positive note on the power of self-reflection. He suggests that significant positive change could occur if well-intentioned people critically examined their beliefs for inconsistencies, rather than trying to change the minds of those with opposing views.

Notable Quotes:

"Obama and going back forever the immigration thuggery…it's not at all new. Trump didn't invent that. But what we're seeing a lot more of right now is the demonization of a whole category of people, those ‘illegals’." - Larken Rose

"One of the first things where it really dawned on me that maybe I was thinking about this differently is the fact that we're calling a person “illegal” because they crossed a border that was created by corrupt elitist." - Craig Harguess

Join Craig and Larken as they navigate these topics, and reflect on liberty, ownership, and the state control and power that can be seized amid public outrage. In the full episode, you’ll find a thought-provoking discussion that questions the status quo at the intersection of faith and immigration.

Connect with Larken:

• The Jones Plantation Film

  • Platforms: Available on Apple TV, Amazon Prime, Tubi, Xmou Play, The Roku Channel, PLEX 

• The Rose Channel

• Book: The Most Dangerous Superstition 

• YouTube

• Candles in the Dark

• Facebook

Episode Timestamps:

(0:22) Immigration and Morality

• Larken Rose returns as a guest to tackle this contentious issue.

(0:51) The Current Immigration Crisis

• Examination of the current immigration situation and its portrayal in the media.

• Comparison of deportation statistics across different U.S. administrations.

• Concerns were raised about the use of detention centers, likened to concentration camps.

• Where was Auschwitz 

(2:52) The "Undesirables" Narrative

• Larken discusses the historical demonization of immigrants as "undesirables."

• Comparison to tactics used by tyrannical regimes to gain power.

(5:57) Christian Perspectives on Immigration

• Christian community's response to immigration policies.

• Calls for a more compassionate, Christ-like approach to the issue.

(10:14) Trump and Authoritarian Rhetoric

• Discussion of Trump's rhetoric, with comparisons to historical authoritarian figures.

• The term "Mango Mussolini" is introduced as a humorous yet pointed critique.

(14:42) Humor as Resistance

• The role of humor in challenging authoritarianism and political figures.

• Balancing humor with the gravity of political issues.

(18:21) Biblical Insights on Authority

• Reflection on how early Christians and Jesus challenged state authority.

• Encouragement for Christians to consider these examples in modern contexts.

(21:07) Libertarian Views on Immigration

• Critique of libertarian inconsistencies regarding immigration.

• Discussion on fear-based versus principle-based decision-making.

(24:29) Fear as a Political Tool

• Analysis of how fear is used to manipulate public opinion on immigration.

• A call for courage and adherence to principles in the face of fear.

(29:23) Language and Labels

• Examination of the term "illegal immigrant" and its implications.

• A Christian perspective on the dehumanization inherent in such labels.

(38:46) Jesus and Legal Compliance

• Addressing claims that Jesus would adhere to immigration laws.

• Historical context of early Christianity's defiance of Roman law.

(54:45) The "Do You Lock Your Doors?" Argument

• Larken challenges common pro-border control arguments.

• Discussion of personal property rights versus national borders.

(59:59) The Mirror Project

• Introduction to Larken's project aimed at encouraging self-reflection and consistency in beliefs.

• Emphasis on examining personal values and beliefs.

(1:02:57) Closing Thoughts and Resources

• Information on Larken's work, including "The Jones Plantation" film.

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Related Episodes

Related Blog Post

132. allegiance to God or Government? with Jason Porterfield

In a world where political divisions run deep and national identity often overshadows faith, how can Christians navigate the complex relationship between church and state? This episode of the Bad Roman Podcast featuring author of Fight Like Jesus: How Jesus Waged Peace Throughout Holy Week, Jason Porterfield, explores the complex relationship between Christianity and the state. 

As Christians, we know we're called to follow Jesus. Yet, many of us find ourselves caught in a web of conflicting loyalties. We pledge allegiance to flags, sing patriotic anthems, and even display national symbols in our places of worship. But is this what Jesus intended for His followers?

Jason challenges us to reconsider our assumptions about Christian citizenship and allegiance. His insights offer a fresh perspective on what it means to be a follower of Christ in a world that falsely demands our loyalty to earthly powers.

The Kingdom of God: More Than Just a Spiritual Concept

When Jesus spoke of the Kingdom of God, He wasn't merely describing a spiritual realm. He was making a bold, politically charged statement that challenged the very foundations of earthly power structures. Yet, many Christians today shy away from this revolutionary concept, preferring instead to speak of the "family of God" or other less confrontational terms.

Why do we do this? Perhaps it's because we've become too comfortable with the idea of dual citizenship – claiming allegiance to both God and country. But as Jason points out, this divided loyalty often leads to a watered-down faith where Jesus becomes Lord of less and less, while Caesar (or the state) claims lordship over everything else.

Consider this: What if we took Jesus' words about the Kingdom of God as seriously as the early Christians did? How might it change our relationship with the state and our understanding of our role in society?

Allegiance vs. Faith: Reclaiming the Power of Pistis

One of the most striking insights from this episode is the discussion around the Greek word "pistis." Often translated simply as "faith," this word carries a much deeper meaning of allegiance or loyalty. When the New Testament writers speak of giving one's pistis to Jesus, they're not just talking about believing in Him – they're calling for a complete transfer of allegiance from earthly powers to Christ.

This understanding challenges the modern Christian tendency to reduce faith to a personal, spiritual matter divorced from political and social realities. It calls us to reconsider what it truly means to declare Jesus as Lord and King.

Ask yourself: Have I reduced my faith in Jesus to mere belief, or am I willing to give Him my complete allegiance, even when it conflicts with the demands of the state?

Flags in the Sanctuary: A Symbol of Divided Loyalties

The presence of national flags in church sanctuaries is a relatively recent phenomenon, yet it's become so commonplace that many Christians don't think twice about it. However, as Jason reminds us, the early church would have found this practice deeply troubling.

Tertullian, an early Christian writer, declared that "the divine banner and the human banner do not go together, nor the standard of Christ and the standard of the devil." These words may sound harsh to modern ears, but they reflect a deep understanding of the exclusive nature of our allegiance to Christ.

Consider this: What message are we sending when we display national symbols alongside Christian ones in our places of worship? Are we inadvertently suggesting that our loyalty is divided between God and country?

Practical Implications: Living as Citizens of Heaven

So how do we live out this radical allegiance to Christ in practical terms? Jason offers several thought-provoking suggestions:

1. Rethink your language: Instead of speaking of Jesus as your personal Savior, try referring to Him as your Lord and King.

2. Reconsider your participation in national rituals: Jason shares how he stands silently during the Pledge of Allegiance, reciting the Lord's Prayer instead.

3. Engage in your community, but with a different perspective: Work for the welfare of your city or country, but do so as an ambassador of Christ's kingdom, not as a citizen of an earthly nation.

4. Be prepared for pushback: Standing firm in your allegiance to Christ may cost you relationships or opportunities, but remember that your citizenship is in heaven.

What We Learned About True Allegiance

This episode challenges us to examine our assumptions about faith, citizenship, and allegiance. It reminds us that following Jesus is not just about personal salvation – it's about pledging our loyalty to a different kingdom altogether.

As we navigate the complex landscape of modern politics and national identity, let's remember that our primary citizenship is in heaven. Our allegiance is to Christ alone, and from that foundation, we can engage with our earthly communities in ways that reflect His love, justice, and peace.

Are you ready to reclaim the revolutionary nature of your faith? Listen to the full episode for more insights on living as citizens of God's kingdom in a world that demands our allegiance. And don't forget to check out Jason Porterfield's book "Fight Like Jesus" for a deeper exploration of how Jesus modeled peacemaking and confronted injustice during Holy Week.

Let's commit to being "bad Romans" – Christians who are willing to challenge the status quo and live out our allegiance to Christ, no matter the cost.

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Episode Timestamps:

(0:22) Episode Overview

• Discussion on phrases used to define the kingdom of God

• Examination of national flags in churches

• Guest Jason Porterfield returns to the show

(0:56) Jason Porterfield Returns to the Show

• Jason Porterfield on Past Bad Roman Episodes

• Waging Peace: Seeing God Before the Resurrection with Jason Porterfield, Episode 54

• Keith Giles & Jason Porterfield - Fight Like a Christian, Episode 14

• Updates on Jason's family and work

• Impact of recent political policies on Jason's life and ministry

(2:47) Current Political Climate

• Craig and Jason discuss the challenges of Christian engagement with politics

• Concerns about Christians celebrating divisive political actions

(4:26) Motivations Behind Jason's Recent Post

• Jason shares the context of a church service that inspired his post

• Reflection on J.D. Vance's comments about Christian priorities

(9:24) Church Diversity and Political Tensions

• Discussion on political diversity within Jason's church (Quaker Friends Church)

• Challenges of maintaining Christian unity amid political differences

(12:27) Analyzing Jason's Four-Point Post

• Point 1: Jesus spoke of the kingdom of God, but that's too political

• Exploration of reducing the meaning of Jesus' teachings

(18:03) The Power of Language in Christian Identity

• Importance of recognizing Jesus as King

• Implications of using "Christ" vs. "King" in reference to Jesus

(24:24) Early Church Perspectives on Allegiance

• Historical examples of early Christians prioritizing allegiance to Christ

• Tertullian's statements on allegiance to God vs. Caesar

(28:22) Jesus' Teachings on Taxes and Allegiance

• Justin Martyr

• Analysis of Jesus' response to paying taxes to Caesar

• Early church interpretations of Jesus' teachings on allegiance

(35:33) The Bruderhof Community's Resistance to Nazism

• Example of Christians maintaining allegiance to Christ during political pressure

• Bonhoeffer's influence on the Bruderhof's stance

(46:21) Flags in Churches and Pledges of Allegiance

• Jason's personal approach to pledges of Allegiance

• Discussion on the presence of national flags in church sanctuaries

(54:56) Jason's Resource: 100 Early Christian Quotes on Not Killing

• Origin and purpose of Jason's compilation of early Christian quotes

• Importance of understanding early church perspectives on violence

(57:51) Jason's Book: Fight Like Jesus

• Overview of the book's focus on Jesus' actions during Holy Week

• Encouragement to read the book during the Lenten season

(59:48) Conclusion and Additional Resources

• Invitation to explore Jason's website for more resources

• Importance of Christians considering their relationship to the state

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